People free of suffering

[sky]

Originally Posted by Redchic12

Mind you I gotta say that when you’ve been in labour for 20 hours giving birth, if someone told me “it’s all in the mind” I probably would have kicked them lol.

Aww but look at the little screeching bundle of joy you get at the end eh...
Btw, you can blame Eve for child birth pain

[sky]

Originally Posted by Maisy

All religions offer some rewards for following them. In Buddhism's case one is to be free of suffering. I wonder if Buddha was going to have open heart surgery if he would opt for no anesthesia (not to be put to sleep) and no pain meds since he was free of all suffering.

As I tried to explain previously suffering is not 'Physical' pain. I'm sure He would use Pain Medication as one who obviously practised 'Right Understanding '...

[Maisy]

Originally Posted by sky

As I tried to explain previously suffering is not 'Physical' pain. I'm sure He would use Pain Medication as one who obviously practiced 'Right Understanding '...

Serious question: Why would he use pain medication if he was not suffering from the pain? I would never use pain medication unless I was suffering from the pain.

Example: Buddha is standing there. Some intense pain comes. Why go get pain medicine if he can just ignore a mental response from the body to try to escape the pain?

I guess you are saying we will always suffer from physical pain? But mental pain is a different thing? So when Buddhism offers to get rid of suffering, we will still suffer from physical pain, like maybe we can't get meds. My friend suffers all the time with intense pain, migraines. I guess you are saying Buddhism cannot help her with this pain and suffering?

[Maisy]

Originally Posted by sky

suffering is not 'Physical' pain.

Physical pain causes some degree of suffering. Physical pain is also on a scale. Some smaller pain can be ignored, other extreme pain sends us into shock and unconsciousness. Some pain and trauma we never get over, it changes us forever, like PTSD from a war. My uncle suffered from that.

Suffering has a lot of causes. Physical, mental/emotional like losing a child. Living in fear is suffering. Isolation from others causes suffering. Hunger etc. One suffers when they are bullied. Suffering from emotional or physical abuse.

I would not say life is suffering like Buddhism may. Life is what we experience. We can be happy, sad, depressed, in joy, in love, in hate. We can suffer and can not suffer. We experience a lot of stuff in a lifetime.

But we can accept what "God" sends us and get rid of some mental suffering that way...but then Buddhism does not believe in a God. So instead of teaching surrender to a higher loving power or God, it says to meditate I suppose. But then Buddhist's pray on prayer wheels don't they? Who are they praying to?

[Maisy]

I had to google it lol

https://imartnepal.com/blog-article/...-meaning-uses/

One of the benefits of the prayer wheel is that it embodies all the actions of the Buddhas and bodhisattvas of the 10 directions. To benefit sentient beings, the buddhas and bodhisattvas manifest in the prayer wheel to purify all our negative karmas and obscurations, and to cause us to actualize the realizations of the path to enlightenment.

So some believe Buddha's manifest in the prayer wheels to grant things.

[sky]

Originally Posted by Maisy

Serious question: Why would he use pain medication if he was not suffering from the pain? I would never use pain medication unless I was suffering from the pain.

My friend suffers all the time with intense pain, migraines. I guess you are saying Buddhism cannot help her with this pain and suffering?

Serious answer... If your body has pain that you cannot live with you use Pain Medication.

I never mentioned your friend and wouldn't know if Buddhism could or couldn't help Her, that's beyond my speculation.

[sky]

Originally Posted by Maisy

I would not say life is suffering like Buddhism may.

The Buddha taught that in life there IS suffering

[Maisy]

Originally Posted by sky

The Buddha taught that in life there IS suffering

Are you sure? Fake quote maybe? Is there a suttra where Buddha says "in life there is suffering?" I would assume no. I'll google it. I thought it was something else. Ah ok so confusing. Buddhism never ever uses the word suffering? Something being unsatisfying is much milder than suffering.

The four Noble Truths are:

1. The truth of the unsatisfactoriness (dukkha sacca)
2. The truth of the cause of the unsatisfactoriness (dukkha-samudāya sacca)
3. The truth of the cessation the unsatisfactoriness (dukkha-nirodha sacca)
4. The truth of the way leading to the cessation of unsatisfactoriness (dukkha-nirodha-gamini-paṭipadā sacca)

Doesn't really matter if one is into practice/mindfulness anyway as all of this is having the attention in mind and words and concepts. Nothing in life actually has a name or word for it. That's all human inventions. The mental world. I think of it like a box one can spend their life or time in.

Oh here's an interesting Buddhism thing:

"Birth is dukkha, aging is dukkha, death is dukkha; sorrow, lamentation, pain, grief, & despair are dukkha; association with the unbeloved is dukkha; separation from the loved is dukkha; not getting what is wanted is dukkha. In short, the five clinging-aggregates are dukkha."

— SN 56.11

There Buddhism is literally saying dukkha includes pain! Yea so I think the idea physical pain and mental pain are different is pretty much ruled out in that quote.

It's probably best to not try to make sense out of ideas from 2000 years ago. They didn't know much back then about the human brain and mind and body etc. Being in a physical body that wears out and stops working, yea it's a challenge for sure. Plus so many are self centered and out for number one. Add in competing for everything. The unfairness of it all. Bad people can get rich, good people can be homeless. But then we don't need Buddhism to tell us what life is as we are living it.

[sky]

Originally Posted by Maisy

So some believe Buddha's manifest in the prayer wheels to grant things.

Prayer Wheels or any mention of them are not found in Buddhas Sutta/Sutras. They actually came from 'Bon' which was a Tibetan indigenous religion which died out when Buddhism arrived in Tibet.... They are Cultural rather than part of Dharma....

[sky]

Originally Posted by Maisy

There Buddhism is literally saying dukkha includes pain! Yea so I think the idea physical pain and mental pain are different is pretty much ruled out in that quote.

Dukkha definitely includes 'pain' .... So in life we have Pain both physical and mental, but we also have joy, happiness, bliss rapture etc:.